S2E1 - Georgie Dent: Advocacy for System Reform
What if Australia truly became the best place in the world to raise a child — what structural reforms would we need to achieve this, and what would be the consequences of inaction?
How can we, individually and collectively, better value the early years workforce to create genuine, lasting change in outcomes for children, families, and society?
In this episode, join Dr Amie Fabry as she chats with Georgie Dent — CEO of The Parenthood, bestselling author, and fearless advocate for families, children, and gender equality. Georgie shares her powerful personal journey into advocacy, the bold mission to make Australia the best place to raise a child, and why real change takes persistence and heart. From major wins in early childhood reform to practical advice for staying hopeful and driving impact, this conversation is packed with inspiration for anyone passionate about building a better future for families and educators.
Georgie Dent is the CEO of The Parenthood, Australia’s leading parent advocacy organisation representing over 80,000 parents, carers and supporters. She is a best-selling author, former lawyer and prominent advocate for children, families, gender equity and mental health. The Parenthood champions paid parental leave, access to quality early childhood education and care and family-friendly workplaces. She is a mum of three and lives in Sydney with her husband & co-partner in chaos.
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Amie Fabry (00:01)
Hello friends and welcome back to Leading the Early Years for the Future. I am your host, Amie Fabry and today I am speaking with Georgie Dent, the CEO of The Parenthood. Georgie is a bestselling author, a former lawyer and she is a prominent advocate for children, families, gender equality and mental health. Georgie, what an absolute joy to be talking with you today. Thank you for joining me.
Georgie Dent (00:26)
Thank you so much for having me.
Amie Fabry (00:28)
My pleasure. The first question I always ask guests on this podcasts is to tell us something about you that might sit outside of your professional role. Do you have a hidden talent or is there something that just lights you up and brings you joy outside of the work you do?
Georgie Dent (00:46)
Look, I think that outside of work, I am a mum to three girls. They're all out of the early years now, so they are currently eight, 12, and 14. One of the things I guess that lights me up is cooking and feeding our family, but also feeding friends. Obviously, I do not take joy in this sort of daily, everyday. when you've got 300 places to be but I do love like on the weekends I love being able to actually cook and I love baking which is not really a hidden talent if you know me because I'll it's quite visible but I do love there's something about making food but particularly making cakes and that I just I really love
Amie Fabry (01:13)
You Yeah. That is so beautiful. I also have girls, two girls, and I also love baking. So we have something in common. Yeah, and I agree. The daily kind of cooking, not so fun, but give me a chance in the kitchen to bake a cake and decorate it beautifully, then that lights me up as well. And it's so great to be able to share that with your children, right? And actually get them in the kitchen cooking and baking with you.
Georgie Dent (01:57)
Yes, exactly. I mean we all eat and so I feel like being able to prepare food, cook food, it's just an essential life skill.
Amie Fabry (02:01)
Ha ha ha ha Mm, so true and such a great way to connect with people and bring joy to other people because who doesn't love yummy delicious food, right? so good. So please tell us about the work you do at the Parenthood. You are a prominent leader and advocate in the early childhood space. I'd love to hear more about your work and what you do.
Georgie Dent (02:16)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, thank you. So I have been the CEO of The Parenthood, which is a not-for-profit advocacy organisation. We represent about 82,000 parents, carers and allies nationally. I say that because we know that there are plenty of in our membership, are grandparents, there are educators, there are teachers. It's not just limited to parents. We have a mission to make Australia the best place in the world to be a parent and raise a child. And it is an unapologetically ambitious mission. And our thinking is that Australia has been and is world leading in different realms. For a long time, we led the world in our vaccination rates. There's lots of different things where we have been world leading. And why not seek to be world leading in the way that we support and nurture children and families, particularly in those all important early years. So I have been the CEO since May of 2020, so it'll be five years soon. I was on the board of this organization for a year before I was invited to become or to interview to become the CEO. I had worked very briefly as a lawyer at the very beginning of my career, and then I got quite sick. I have Crohn's disease and I had a pretty significant nervous breakdown when I was 24. And ultimately I left law after that because I just needed to focus on my physical and my mental health. And then I ended up starting over, guess, in business journalism. And I became a journalist and I worked as a journalist for about 10 years. And as a journalist, it was over that period of time that we had our three girls. ⁓ and I became really fixated on why there was such a gender gap in leadership. So I was working for a business magazine and I was just fascinated that there was still so few female CEOs of leading companies or so few equity partners in law firms who were women or accounting firms or consulting firms. I had gone to school in uni. really believing that gender equity was sort of on the way to being resolved. And by the time, you know, my cohort of peers would be in the workplace, it would be sorted. Obviously, when I got into the workforce, I realized that I was sadly and naively mistaken. And so as a business journalist, I became really fixated on why that gender gap was so stubborn. And having children of our own was very illuminating because in a practical sense, I could really see why. So many families did make choices. But I put choices in inverted commas. They make choices about who works and who stays at home. And it's not necessarily free choice. is just, this is what we're forced into doing. And so really since that time, I've been pretty, I've been on a bit of a mission to explore what the sort of structural solutions to that would be. And that has led me into the role that I am today as a sort of formal advocate for early childhood education and care, for better paid parental leave, for family, family workplace practices, but also more broadly about recognising and valuing the significance of the early years of parenting, of what that entails.
Amie Fabry (06:12)
Wow, what an amazing journey you've been on and what an incredible story. Thank you for sharing that. So honestly, there's so many amazing things in there. Firstly, I want to acknowledge the mission, you know, and you say unapologetically ambitious, which I just love because I completely agree with you. You know, why isn't Australia the best place to be a child or to raise a child? ⁓ I recently was fortunate enough to, to visit Denmark and I met an educator and a parent there who actually said to me, I am so lucky to be a parent here living in Denmark. And I thought, wow, isn't that amazing that, you know, someone can actually say that. Wouldn't that be amazing if that was the case here in Australia? ⁓ so, you know, the work that you're doing through the parenthood is so admirable and it's so needed. And I love your journey of how you got into this space too, you know, as a parent yourself and I completely relate, you know, in terms of gender equity, but even when you think about those choices that you say, you know, like who's looking after the children, who's staying home, who's caring for them. And it's not just the physical day to day. you know, who's in the home with them, perhaps, but it's all the mental load that comes with that, you know, there's a lot to consider when we think about raising children. And there are so many decisions that parents have to make, including whether they're back at work, or they're staying at home and how often and where they go and you know, which service will I take my children to like, it's really complex and really overwhelming as a parent. So Thank you for the work that you do at the Parenthood. And recently we've seen lots of changes. So I'd love you to talk us through some of the really key pieces that the Parenthood has been advocating for leading these conversations. And I think so much of advocacy is kind of first and foremost about actually getting it on people's radars. So we can have the conversation because... Otherwise we don't even know that we should be having the conversation. Has that been your experience?
Georgie Dent (08:33)
Yes, it has. And actually I had this really unusual and quite emotional realization towards the end of last year that I'll take a step back. But at The Parenthood, I have said to you that our mission is to make Australia the best place in the world to be a parent and raise a child. And obviously it's one thing to have a mission statement, but it's another thing to sort of have a roadmap to how to get there. And so we did a pretty significant piece of research in 2021 looking at what are the policies, the evidence-based policies that would improve outcomes for parents and children in the early years. And I want to be really clear that there are basic material needs that all children have that if they're not being met, then all of this stuff is a moot point. But so things like having safe housing, having access to running water, access to decent food, which you would hope in Australia is the absolute baseline and yet we do have communities that don't have those basic needs. So it's worth pointing that out. The three policies that we have identified as systemic levers that would create the most optimal outcomes for the greatest number of children and parents. It's one year of paid parental leave that's shared between parents where there are two parents and paid a replacement wage rate. That would be a world leading paid parental leave policy. It wouldn't be the longest paid parental leave policy in the world, but what 12 months gives, particularly when it's at a replacement wage rate, where there is flexibility and scope for parents to share that care, it creates more equitable caregiving patterns in that first year. And during that first year, when it is absolutely critical, there is a health recovery and healing that needs to occur. however you bring a baby into the world and really paid parental leave is about that first and foremost. But it also sets patterns about how people care that actually persist over the course of a baby's life. So when you can enable both mums and dads or two mums or two dads to actually share the care.
Georgie Dent (10:52) outcomes actually improve for children, but also the mental health and physical health and wellbeing of both mums and dads or both parents improves too. So that's one of our big policy goals. The next policy goal is for every child to have access to totally affordable, quality, inclusive early childhood education and care that's delivered by a professionally paid and supported workforce. So you know all of this, but quality early learning is life changing for children. It is this silver bullet when it comes to combating disadvantage and inequity before it becomes entrenched. You can set children up on a more positive trajectory if they have that opportunity in those early years. And the benefits that it has for children alone make this a reform we need to invest in.
Amie Fabry (11:27) Mm-hmm. Yep. Hmm.
Georgie Dent (11:51)
But the other part of it, is also really important is that early education and care is essential infrastructure for parents to be able to participate in the paid workforce. in 2025, the economic reality is it is now a very rare and sort of a very privileged household where only one income is needed. We just don't live in a world anymore where that is the norm, where one income can support a family.
Georgie Dent (12:19)
We know at the Parenthood when we've polled parents, the financial pressure is so significant and they do need, they tell us, they need two incomes just to meet the cost of living. But because of that, we then have this sort of cost of working trap for a of parents because if they can't access suitable care or they can't afford it or the out-of-pocket cost becomes so high that it's sort of worth only doing two shifts a week instead of four or five, then the financial pressure is compounded because you've either got you know you're not able to actually increase the income base that your family needs just to get by. So parents having access to totally affordable high quality early education and care that is supported to meet the needs of their children and their community is absolutely critical to realise our ambition of making Australia the best place in the world to be a parent. The third policy reform that we're interested in is every parent having access to a family-friendly workplace, a workplace that values caring and caregiving among men and women. In the time that I've been CEOs, we have seen, so the election of the Albanese government in May of 2022 was a significant turning point for these sorts of policy ambitions because going into the last election, the now Prime Minister Anthony Albanese said that if he was elected, he would like universal early childhood education and care to be the ultimate legacy that he would leave. That was really significant because we hadn't had that before, not in a sort of such a focused way. And so we have seen some significant changes. So we have had the paper rental leave scheme increased. from 20 weeks to 26 weeks by 2026. We've seen superannuation be included on that. There are two changes that we have been campaigning for. We're gonna keep campaigning because we want one year and we want it at a replacement wage rate. But we are stoked and this is what I have learned that when you're in this realm of advocacy, you have to take the incremental wins. And the incremental wins are actually... They are really significant. So in terms of paid parental leave, we have come a long way and we will continue pushing for more, but it is very heartening to actually make some progress and get some wins on the board because it's motivating. It keeps you going because you think, you know what, we lean in enough, I'm leaning is a terrible expression that I don't, but if we actually advocate and champion these changes, it is possible for progress to occur.
Georgie Dent (15:07)
We have also seen the this federal government announce a 15 % wage increase for early educators to be paid in two tranches. Now, notwithstanding some of the challenges around the administration and bureaucracy of that, we have already seen staff vacancy rates drop by 22%, which is so significant because we know there's no early education without early educators. And we know that The high rate of staff turnover in early education has always been an issue, but it was really accelerated by both COVID and the escalating cost of living. Those two factors sort of created a perfect storm where educators were exhausted and or increasingly unable to afford to stay working for the wages they were. So the 15 % wage increase is really significant because we see that as a critical component of building a quality universal system, we need the workforce. So that's been a big win. The government did make a significant investment in the childcare subsidy to make it more affordable for families and that has had a benefit. At The Parenthood, we don't believe the childcare subsidy is ultimately the mechanism by which we should fund a truly universal early education care system. The reason for that is we've seen this, the ACCC pointed this out.
Georgie Dent (16:35)
Every time the government puts more money into the childcare subsidy, fees inevitably grow faster and then the affordability relief is eaten up and we've seen that happen. So the investment is significant because it was a recognition that the cost is a big problem for families. We believe there's still a significant piece of work to do around affordability. We would love for early education and care to be free.
Georgie Dent (17:02)
For children of families from low income, like the Productivity Commission recommended. And we believe we should have a supply side funding model where parents pay a contribution, whether it's 10 or $20 a day, with the vast majority of funding coming directly from the government. And then the other significant piece of reform that has occurred is the Albanese government legislated a three day guarantee for children. And in doing so, have greatly reduced the activity test, which has been so punitive, it has locked out too many of the children who would benefit the most from early education and care. All of these pieces together are a really compelling case for how reform occurs. So I would love if tomorrow we could just wake up and design this brand new beautiful system that actually works for children. for educators, for families, communities, for the economy, I would love that. It's not quite so simple. And so we have to be able to work with what we've got and make the necessary adjustments on the path to bold reform. And last year in December, when the Prime Minister was announcing the three day guarantee commitment, as well as announcing that they would invest a billion dollars in 160 early learning services in areas of need.
Georgie Dent (18:29) I was listening to that speech and I actually got really emotional because back in 2014, I wrote a column. I was an editor of a women's website at the time, Women's Agenda. And I wrote a column that was basically an open letter to the then Prime Minister Tony Abbott and the Treasurer Joe Hockey. And I just said, please come in my car. So we were, I wanted him to come, I wanted one of them to come with me one morning and experience what it was like to try and get to work because like lots of sort of young families who were living in Sydney. We had had two children, we were living in the eastern suburbs, we were renting a tiny apartment, we couldn't do it anymore. We moved across the bridge to get a little bit more space, which was amazing, but we couldn't get the girls into any early learning on this side of the bridge for seven months. So for seven months, I would get both little girls into the car, we would drive across the harbour bridge in peak hour traffic, I would drop them and then I would make my way to work and we would do it every afternoon.
Georgie Dent (19:28)
And I had this, at the time there was a lot of discussion about lifters and leaners in the economy and who, you know, who wants a handout and who's willing to sort of work hard. And I just had this searing sense of, I want to work. I am working, but it is so difficult. And I'm not asking for a handout, but what I am asking for is for every community to have where they live, the ability for their children to participate in quality early.
Georgie Dent (19:59)
And that was where my head was. And it really does in some ways feel like I haven't really wavered from that, wanting someone to take this seriously. And so last year listening to the prime minister speak about that, it was a really sort of profound moment for me because I was like, this is a person who is standing up there who is the prime minister, who is saying Early education and care is not a luxury measure. It is not welfare. It is critical for the education and development of children, but it's also critical for families to get by. So that's a really long answer to that question.
Amie Fabry (20:29)
Hmm. What an amazing, what an amazing answer. Georgie, that is so profound, you know, to think back a few years to you taking on this role and, you know, acknowledging too, that it's not only your advocacy that's led to these really big shifts in policy, of course, but you have played a role. You know, you have been publicly advocating. for these changes, for putting children first, for putting families first, for actually supporting our workforce in early learning. And, know, I just can only imagine what it must actually feel like to see the impact that that is having and, you know, noting that it takes time, right? And one of the things that I really picked up on that you said was, you know, actually being able to take note and celebrate even the small wins because you might not get quite where you want to go, particularly straight away. But you know, when we're talking about real system reform, and if I think about some of the educators and leaders that I work alongside, you know, we're all hoping for a better system that does support children, families and educators. And even sometimes when we think about learning and what are the pressures on learning and all of those things that, you know, we know could be better. Advocacy to me can be really challenging because you need to play a long-term game, right? And it's not about what can I get tomorrow or next week. And I imagine that takes a lot of patience. I'm keen to hear, you know, celebrating the small wins and noticing where you're actually making some gains and shifts is a really key learning, but really wise, you know, to actually call that out and say that that's the process. Is there anything else that you've kind of learned or picked up along the way in terms of that advocacy piece and how it works and what's worth paying attention to that, you know, I guess those things that give you hope and motivation to keep going.
Georgie Dent (22:44)
Yeah, look, it's a great question and it is worth noting that all of the gains that have been secured have been the effort of really campaigns that have been... fought for so long, much longer than even I've been a parent for. These are sort of big issues that women in particular have been fighting for for a really long time. But also they have been the result of some coordinated advocacy from a number of different organizations. So there are lots of organizations in Australia that have got a deeply positive vested interest in better paid parental leave and better early education and care. So there is an incredible alliance of organizations and individuals. And I guess that would be one of my learnings is that when there is some coordination and collaboration, it is possible to really accelerate and sort of exponentially amplify your message.
Georgie Dent (23:54)
because it is absolutely true that we have had a really extraordinary sort of three or four years in bringing this issue in particular around early education and care right to the top of the national agenda. And that is the result of a number of different organisations and individuals working separately and together to make that the case. So it's not an accident that this issue has stayed on the agenda. It has been the result of really deliberate collaboration. think one of the things that I have learned is, mean, one of the things I guess that means I feel so incredibly grateful to have a job that fills me with the sense of purpose that this does. You know, I, of course I have days where I wake up and I think, my gosh, what am going to do today? Well, you know, you ebb and flow in terms of I don't wake up every single day wanting to climb a mountain. But there is something really motivating about having a clear sense of purpose. And, you know, I worked in sort of more broadly in gender equality reporting, gender equity reporting. did report for a while around domestic violence and violence against women.
Georgie Dent (25:17)
And I have, there's a huge number of issues that I'm really interested in. But one of the things that I've been grateful for at the Parenthood is really knowing where my true north is for our organization and why we're chasing that. it is that paid parental leave, the early education and care and the family friendly workplace practices. That's not to say there aren't other issues that I really care about. And I definitely will try and do things when I can. But I've also just come to realize that.
Georgie Dent (25:46)
I'm going to be so much more effective at leading this organisation if we stay unapologetically focused and ambitious for our objectives. And I guess I've been in this role for four and a half years, but it's changed. It is constantly changing because when you have got reform of this scale, as I've said, there are so many different elements to it. There's the access issues, there's the workforce issues, there's the quality issue, there's the affordability issue. One of the things that I think we've done quite well, the Parenthood, but also as part of the Thrive by Five campaign that the Minderoo Foundation have funded, one of the things that we've done is constantly evaluate and assess where the opportunities are for keeping to get stories in the media, whether it's about families who can't get into services, whether it's about educators who are leaving.
Georgie Dent (26:47)
And I suppose we're sort of constantly thinking about what can we do to sort of mobilize and engage parents and carers? How can we engage the media? How can we directly engage with politicians? And so you're kind of constantly looking for where are the gaps, where are the opportunities? How can we get this issue where we want it to be? And that means it's quite interesting because it hasn't been the same tactic or strategy the whole time. It's always different. But it does also, it does take patience and that is something that, look, I think I am impatient. I really wish a lot of this was a lot better. But I also, think that... I'm really, I almost said this before when you asked about the hidden talent, but I am really, really stubborn and determined in this regard. I just, our own experience just showed me how wild the system is. And we have got so many privileges and we were able to make it work, but it was so tricky to make it work. And that's what I would like the system to work for and with families and children and educators, not against them. And I just, think that experience, something flipped inside of me that hasn't ever wavered that I know that this can be better and it has to be better. And so I think that's often what I return to when I'm having a harder days or if I'm sort of struggling for motivation, it is easy to sort of step back and think, right, this is where I've come from. This is where we're going.
Amie Fabry (28:21)
Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. That's, that's really powerful. You know, having that strong sense of purpose and for you, it comes from your own lived experience, right? Like there's nothing more powerful than that. You know, knowing that this is actually what it's like to be in the shoes of working parents who are trying to raise a family, you know, and all the parental guilt that comes with, am I doing a good job as a parent? You know, on top of trying to work and have an income and keep a roof above your head. Like it's so much pressure. You know, that lived experience that you're talking about, I can see how it's such a driving force and your true North, you know, helping you to kind of be really clear about what is the change that I'm trying to drive and advocate for. to keep going. And I think, you know, if I reflect on my own sense of purpose, that's what gets me out of bed too, you know, even on the hard days where you don't have the energy or you feel a little tired or you've had a few knockbacks, you know, remembering that does help you keep going. And particularly when you see some of those wins to help motivate you. You mentioned some of the challenges, you know, that there's a constantly evolving landscape. You mentioned trying to reach lots of different stakeholders in lots of different formats. Can you talk through some of the, what have been some of the biggest challenges being an advocate to really lead some of this reform and this change.
Georgie Dent (30:00)
Yeah, I mean, in the early days, so when I became CEO, it was right in the middle of COVID, so May of 2020, which feels like a different world in so many ways. But we, the then federal government was... there was a level of disregard or hostility to these issues and the significance of these issues. there is definitely, there are challenges with being vocal and being visible and having sort of any form of sort of public profile. And so certainly I would say probably in those, the first two years I was in the job, one of the biggest challenges was navigating the pressure of, of that sort of public being in the public eye, being open to sort of criticism. Because I was being, we were very critical of government policies. And if you're going to engage in that, which you have to, if you're trying to create change, you sort of have to, you do step into the lion's den a little bit. And that is not always easy. I think that I can see, you I read these surveys, you you read research about women being less, women being more reluctant to step into roles with any sort of public facing aspect because of that sort of fear of the backlash.
Georgie Dent (31:44)
And I read that and I understand it because it is really full on to be in a sort of storm in any public sense. What I would say is I have been incredibly lucky to have some professional and personal, you know, supports that have had my back. unconditionally. you know, the patron of the parent called Wendy McCarthy, who is just an absolute living treasure, who is 83 and more dynamic than most people that you'd ever meet. She has been a long time advocate for early childhood education and care, and she's been involved in so many aspects of public life and having her on speed dial was invaluable.
Georgie Dent (32:37)
I am so certain that her strategic counsel is one of the reasons that we have been able to be effective in this space because I had her expertise and wisdom. I've, you know, working alongside, you know, Jay Weatherill, who's the CEO of the Minderoo Foundation. We've had, we've been supported. I have been supported. And then in a personal sense, you know, having... a loving and kind family and friends helps enormously to sort of when that stuff is ugly. So that's one of the challenges that I would say. But it has been different lately. When the last three years have been much more focused on shaping policies, as opposed to seeking for policies to be even considered, if that makes sense. So we were trying to say.
Georgie Dent (33:33)
Think about this. Think about the way early education care is limiting women and families and the economy and children. actually, that's something that I will say as well, that it's when you are advocating in any space, there are a variety of stakeholders that you're interested in that you need to engage with. And there are a couple of things where.
Georgie Dent (33:59)
To sort of get attention or an issue, you need to be able to highlight the problems because no one has ever signed a great big check for reform when someone says the system is working so well but could you just do a couple of things around the edges. You have to be able to say this is broken, it is not working and here are all the ways it's not working and here are all the arguments for investing in it. And I said this at the start that children's outcomes, development, education, wellbeing, that in itself should be enough to get this issue on the agenda.
Georgie Dent (34:28)
But in the previous sort of political landscape that we were in, if we weren't making an argument around the economic case or the business case for this, we weren't going to get the support we needed from politicians, but also within the community to say, actually, yeah, this would be a good thing to vote for if it's good for the economy. But then there are people, and I understand this, I had this conversation with a lot of different early childhood educators that they found that quite offensive that you would rely on.
Georgie Dent (34:57)
the business case or the economic thing or women working. Whereas this is sort of to my point earlier that you need to be pivoting and adjusting your messaging all the time depending on the environment you're in. And it has been great that over the last three years we have been able to focus as much on children's development as we're talking about families being able to participate in the paid workforce.
Amie Fabry (35:00)
Hmm. Yeah. Awesome. There's so much advice in there. You're talking about like reaching different people to engage in a conversation. And what I'm hearing is, if I have this right, it's also about adjusting the message perhaps to what their invested interests might be in the problem. You know, like if you're talking and advocating to educators, for example, their priority is not going to be, you know, working parents, but it will be the children, whereas politicians are more worried about the economy. you know, the angle of workforce participation becomes really relevant to them in terms of your argument. Is that kind of what you're saying?
Georgie Dent (35:55)
Mm-hmm. Yes, definitely. So we have got a variety of different arguments that you would pull on and draw from for particular audiences. And that's sort of just on a micro level, but then there are also ways that you're looking for, how can I create the right opportunity for this particular argument? So, know, for example, just this week we've had in New South Wales, been reports this week in some of the papers about how
Amie Fabry (36:15)
Hmm.
Georgie Dent (36:36)
the Department of Education wants to improve a whole lot of sort of academic outcomes for children in New South Wales in primary and secondary school. And my immediate thought is if we're not talking about how we're setting children up in the early years, those efforts are not going to succeed. The evidence is so clear on that that when we've got children arriving at school developmentally vulnerable. We are limiting their potential and that is no slight on them and it is no slight on the teachers in the primary school. But we cannot overcome that if we don't have a proper conversation about the early years. So that's, think that's just on a micro level. The kind of thing that I'm thinking about is if I get called to ask for comment on that story or if I wanted to call a journalist and say, have you thought about this? Then that's the way I would get the story in there.
Amie Fabry (37:09) you Mm. Yeah, so good. Using what's topical, right? Like what's part of the conversation right now and how does your argument and what you're advocating for fit into that? That's brilliant. I also love before you were talking about sort of like, I guess having a few phases perhaps of advocacy where in the beginning you were actually just getting it on the radar. Why is this a problem? Why should we pay attention to it?
Georgie Dent (37:29) Mm.
Amie Fabry (37:52) And then you're kind of now shifting into, well now it's on the radar. What should it look like? Has that also been like a process in terms of advocacy?
Georgie Dent (37:57)
Mm-hmm. Yes, absolutely, because it's a completely different game. one of the, you know, this, the Albanese government have been really interested in these areas of legislation. So, and there's a lot of organizations and individuals that would tell you the same story, but they came into office and then all of a sudden there were all of these legislative inquiries and Senate committees and hearings. And that was an opportunity to prepare submissions, to present and speak and bring families in.
Amie Fabry (38:24) Mmm.
Georgie Dent (38:32) which was a completely different landscape professionally than what it had looked like previously. And there's been those iterations. And I guess that's one of the things that is...
Amie Fabry (38:40) Yeah.
Georgie Dent (38:49) Like it is, I have really enjoyed the last couple of years really being able to have sort of substantive conversations about what a better system could actually look like. Not just a conversation about why we need a better system. But you know, the truth is Australia is back, you know, we will be having a federal election at some point before May and it will have a huge impact on what early years policies look like.
Amie Fabry (39:00) Hmm. ⁓ Mm-hmm.
Georgie Dent (39:18) So depending on who is elected and what is the proportion of power, what does the crossbench look like? It could change really dramatically again. And so there's that element of needing to have all of the arguments at your disposal to be able to deploy as and when they're needed. And I guess one of the things that I always say as an advocate is an incredible gift is that
Amie Fabry (39:27) Hmm. Yeah.
Georgie Dent (39:50) When in the realm of campaigning for high quality, universal early childhood education and care that's inclusive, that's delivered by a properly paid and supported workforce, there is no argument against this except that it costs a lot of money. And the answer to that is we are already spending an extraordinary amount of money on getting this wrong because we're failing too many children. We are not, we're failing too many educators.
Georgie Dent (40:20)
We're failing too many families. We're paying the price for that over and above what we're paying for the actual existing system that isn't delivering for enough children and families. So I love that you give me a group of people and I will tell you the ways in which their lives will be better indirectly or directly by Australia having this infrastructure. And I like, I enjoy, I enjoy being able to advocate for a policy that is so positive.
Amie Fabry (40:20)
Hmm. Yeah. Hmm. Yeah
Georgie Dent (40:49)
I really enjoy that. makes my job easy. I think it would be a lot harder if you were advocating for different sort of policy where there would be legitimate, ⁓ this wouldn't work and yeah.
Amie Fabry (40:59)
Mm. Mm. Totally. I can just hear the passion in your voice, Georgie, as you talk about this and your face just lights up talking about it. It is so inspiring hearing about your journey and your experience as an advocate and, you know, the challenges you're learning, but even the impacts that you've seen in the last four and a half years and the difference. So inspiring. am learning so much from you. I'm so grateful. to you for sharing and for being on the podcast to share your experience and your journey as a leader. I'm conscious of time. So I just wanna ask one final question. Do you have any final thoughts or words of advice for anyone in the sector? know, whether they're an educator working alongside children who can see that there's potential for change, whether they're a policymaker, someone in your kind of position that's feeling a little... uninspired or lacking energy or thinking, is it all worth it? Do you have any advice for those of us in the sector who also want a brighter future?
Georgie Dent (42:08)
Yeah, look, what I would say to you and to everybody and anybody who is listening to this who works in early childhood education in any realm, whether it's directly as a teacher, as an educator, whether it's in policy. Thank you. The work that you guys do is genuinely life-changing. It is shaping little brains and it is work that has for far too long been chronically and woefully undervalued. And yes, undervalued in pay, but also in an incorrect, inaccurate perception of what your work and what that role actually looks like and what it entails. So I would say thank you. I would say don't ever shy away from the fact that if you know in your heart that it can be better, do not ignore your heart. It can be better. And I know that's really hard when you're working in a system and you just think, how can we do this? But I would like everybody to hold on to hope and to join.
Georgie Dent (43:18) organizations and individuals that are advocating for these changes and believe in them because it is possible to make progress. And frankly, I'm not willing to imagine what this would look like without progress. So I think we have to stay fixed on the ambitious vision. And that is an early years, an early childhood education care system that genuinely delivers for all children.
Georgie Dent (43:46)
and educators and parents. And that is within our reach. There are countries that do it. You know, it's not like we're like this is and also we know and you know this and our audience know this. There are problems with our system, but there are some incredible parts and the educators themselves are like 95 % of that because that is really like we know you can talk. Obviously there's a lot that goes into quality, but at the end of the day, it's about the educators. And if we have
Amie Fabry (43:52)
Yeah, absolutely. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Yeah.
Georgie Dent (44:16)
well-trained, well-supported, properly funded educators and resources in services, then we will have a great system. And it is possible.
Amie Fabry (44:20)
Mm-hmm. Absolutely. That is such great advice. I love that you said don't ignore what is in your heart. Because, you know, if I reflect too on everything we've talked about, one of the standout things for me is we're really stronger together, right? And you said when you join forces in a deliberate collaborative way, you actually get more traction quicker. And I think, you know, for everybody working at all levels and all roles of our entire sector. collectively we all make a difference and the more we listen to what's in our hearts and speak up and stand up and raise conversations and start conversations and talk to lots of different people, I think, you together that the future does look very bright and hopeful. Thank you so much for your time. It was such a joy to meet you, Georgie, to hear about your experience. I've learnt so much and so grateful to the work that you do and for being here.
Georgie Dent (45:20)
Thank you, Amie I really appreciate having the opportunity to meet you and speak to your audience. And I guess the only other thing that I would say that I should have said before is obviously join the parenthood. It's free to sign up. And look, the whole premise of the parenthood is to give voice to parents because we know that individual parents, particularly in the early years, do not have the time to get themselves organized and campaign for systemic change. So we do that for you.
Georgie Dent (45:50)
And we are like when when parents speak together as one voice, they're a lot harder to ignore the when individual parents speak. And as I said at the start, our community is for anybody who's invested in better outcomes in the early years. So everyone is welcome to join us and keep an eye on what our sort of activities are to try and ensure our advocacy and our effective advocacy continues.
Amie Fabry (45:57)
Mm. Hmm. Wonderful. What a great call to action. Thank you so much. We will put a link to the parenthood in the show notes as well for everyone to find very easily. But Google will also be your friend. Thank you so much, Georgie. Such a delight to chat to you today.
Georgie Dent (46:33)
Thanks, Amie
